welcome to the deliberate way I’m Dan sewald your host and I’m joined today by my friend Greta Meyer who’s working fem
Tech and product development just continues to amaze me now a few words
about you Greta Greta is the CEO and co-founder of SQL which is a women’s
health company focused on product Innovation and your first big breakout
product is a redesign of something that’s kind of old and familiar the
tampon and Greta and your co-founder Amanda reimagine the tampon to be more
fluid efficient more comfortable and safer and it’s probably not going to
come as a surprise that Greta studied engineering and product design at the
esteemed Stanford University where she was first inspired to rethink this area
and uh just a few other things that are important to know about you Keta you’ve worked in a whole diversity of areas
from furniture engineering I actually have an end table that needs some fixing by the way AI enabled consumer
electronics um and Hardware design and I’d be remiss if I didn’t mention how
your experience as a D1 lacrosse player at Stanford contribute in no small way
to this really cool product reinvention that we’re going to talk about so Greta awesome to have you here thanks for
joining thank you Dan that was a very kind introduction and I’m happy to be here nice to see you well you I can
think of no better way for us to get started talking than to ask you about inventing something new out of something
old Now product developers are always looking for Consumer insights to discover that next big thing but you
know insights aren’t like apples on a tree just waiting to be plucked where did you find the inspiration or you know
the the human Insight if you will where did it come from that made you want to reinvent the tampon something that’s
been around for generations and and honestly I wouldn’t have thought it’s something that was due for
reinvention yeah absolutely so my I think this all starts with my time on
the Stanford lacrosse team um one of my best friends who was on the team with me at the time was very very vocal about
not liking her tampon and we actually had a very funny kind of situation that
looking back on it now is almost a movie scene where we’re in in our dorm room
together sketching ideas on sticky notes on Post-it notes um and at the time we
did not come up with anything but that was that was a moment of realization where as a consumer we were thinking why
isn’t this working you know we are having this need where we Define as we’re running onto the onto the lacrosse
field we’re wearing white skirts Everyone is always in practice or in game saying can you check me and that to
us told us these tampons are not working so that was that was the true point
where we realize okay as a consumer I’m dissatisfied with this product then for
SQL the company my co-founder and I this was a couple years later were in a class
project actually and tasked with a hypothetical startup and so we were tasked to look at a a need space and
then do some more structured need finding and what a friend of mine who had taken the class in years prior said
do something that you won’t that you really care about that you won’t get sick of interviewing people about for
the 10 weeks of the class and so we actually had a couple boys in our class project at the time had convinced them
okay if you guys let us do menstrual cycles we will do all of the user research because obviously that you’re
maybe not the best people to do those interviews um and that was a really wonderful partnership where we were able
to have this structure of a class to do this research and found a lot of data to
support our anecdotal experience which was 70% of us women use tampons but
there’s High dissatisfaction with those so what we Define that as is when people
are using tampons or preferring them they’re also using a backup method so period underwear panty liners because
they think oh I think my tampon is going to leak I’m not sure how long it’s going to take um so then we started looking at
why was that looking at the fluid mechanics behind it as you mentioned we’ve made something that’s designed to
be more fluid mechanically efficient so in that process um we started looking at
the construction of the tampon really where the fluid was going why there was premature leakage and found that it was
due to these linear channels going down the side being the most prominent feature and what we did there is
incorporate additional channels so things channels that will take it around the circumference rather than just the
side and hence the the spiral tampon did your did your design look like the
Post-it note that you’d come up with in your dorm room at all any any reflection at all from that not really we it’s
funny the the original kind of notes by the way do you still have them we we did
look for them um they were mostly around the problem I think we didn’t really
come up with many solutions and that was actually one of the great things about having this class is that a
lot of times when you’re thinking about problems you’re trying to jump to the conclusion the class really forced us to
say okay you’re GNA have to do hundreds of interviews Define the problem and it was it was not until it really was the
night before the the class project that we were thinking okay we’ve defined this we know this problem what could possibly
do it and that’s when we had the first sketch that is now that was our on our original deck and is in our original
provisional patent amazing you know I I you you triggered a memory not very long
ago the the women’s English national team for soccer football um but soccer
as we would call it that they were forced to wear white uh shorts in their
kits and um they were very upset about it was a big battle I think with Nike to
change him to make them blue and they didn’t appreciate that you know this was the reason they
explained like we’re worried about leakage you know from you know if you’re in your menstrual cycle and um that that
was the product was made and marketed by men to women who would didn’t even think about it so it’s it’s very interesting
and I guess that’s not atypical if you were experiencing that in college and people are still talking about it today
and it’s being largely ignored but is there greater awareness or do you think it’s still just not talked about a lot
yeah absolutely I mean I think there are there are many Trends there you mentioned one which is the the changing
of that that color and we actually saw that also reflected in Wimbledon they changed their all whites rule um so that
you can wear a different color bottom which is pretty amazing just in terms of the the response that it’s that you know
people are actually openm minded to it once you do talk about it but we see that I think you’re bringing up the the
idea of taboo where you’re not for the the norm is that it is not a comfortable thing to talk about something that you
might not want to bring up to your head coach or your equipment person but and the reality is and this is what was the
most astounding I think when we first started thinking about this is you know on game day we’re getting there they
know what we’re eating 24 hours before the game we’re getting there eight hours before you know they know what socks
we’re wearing how our ankles are taped every little detail to make sure that you’re fully focused on the field but
this is such an afterthought because it’s not really talked about it’s so interesting even to your point about
Wimbleton so difficult to change that idea of of whites on the tennis court
it’s always been a tradition you wore a white top a white bottom I it’s amazing that that they were able to create a
shift there because they’re so steeped in Tradition and traditions are hard to break but um absolutely very exciting
well I want to take another step back for a moment um you know dozens of
friends and colleagues tell me that they want to be an entrepreneur too and there’s a lot of romanticizing about
startup culture with this non-stop reel of Shark Tank episodes and you know it’s
always running and everybody’s kind of wants to be an entrepreneur um why did
you go the startup entrepreneur route you’re at Stanford you’ve got a promising career you could probably go
to most manufacturers and or or any you know large company um what do people not
know that they should know before entering this world and why did you go this route versus a traditional
corporate route yeah I think I think the the word that you said was spoton which is it’s
it’s very romanticized um especially at a place like Stanford we were encouraged
to to explore those ideas I think it’s wonderful to be surrounded by such an entrepreneurial spirit and definitely
does produce some amazing entrepreneurs but you do get that cohort of people who
they they are more obsessed with the idea of not having a boss or being being
thought of as a founder or a Visionary or something like that um and don’t necessarily appreciate what the
day-to-day is or what that truly means um and so I think I was definitely not in that camp I was interested obviously
these are amazing stories that you’re surrounded by but I think the the one
that stands out as well is the one of someone like James Dyson who was kind of
thought of as crazy or it was delusional for thinking that you know making
something in a vacuum would be um a great business and so what we end up
seeing is really the positives but if you if you think about what Dyson as an
example was you know the year before they made their big break he I think had been working on this project for 20 30
years without making making any money on it iterations is that I don’t know if I
made that up or I’ve read somewhere like he had had thousand somewhere like 5,000 iterations um you know with little
tweaks which that that could take decades I think yeah yeah and I and it
was not you know there’s a lot there are a lot of sacrifices that you do to make that possible so for him it was you know
Financial Security of his family I think there was a lot on the line for him he had this conviction this belief and this
that conviction in okay iterating on this and failing many times is going to yield something beautiful and amazing
but I think we you do get in this dangerous romanticization of they’re all
GNA F they’re all going to work out like that and the reality is that’s not what he felt like every day you know it was
probably a very challenging environment for him and and maybe for him at home because he put so much on the line for
that so that’s what I would say is that it’s also you know in in retrospective
something goes right it’s the okay I jumped off a cliff and learned how to fly on the way down and that’s in fact a
very true metaphor however in the moment it is a calculated decision based on
many small D risks that you’re taking so for me it was not oh I have this idea
let me throw everything to the wind you know we actually we six months later we
graduated that was really important we did not drop out of school um and in
fact I didn’t forgo I had a full-time job that I was going to be starting and I didn’t throw that away until many
months later so I I just talked to my boss and said do you think we could push off the start date I really want to
explore this idea um full well knowing you know you’re signing up for something that’s very high risk and I think that’s
something that your for have to remember is he he still waiting for that or no
well we did we kicked it off a couple times she she’s an amazing head of the product organization at um at Comcast
and she I was very excited for her mentorship but I at the same time that was really my decision was okay I would
regret not pursuing this and seeing this all the way through full well knowing the risks um would I always think what
if there and I think that’s absolutely how I made my decision but we did really say okay let’s work on this for the
summer after graduating let’s see what we do then I push my start date to November and then when we first took on
investment that was the that’s obviously the inflection point of okay uh I’ve
made a made a commitment now to my investors and and I won’t be coming coming to join you guys well that that’s
that’s when it gets very very real when there’s actual dollars are in there you’re right well tell me a little a
little bit more about your journey so how long did it take you to be where you are now and what do you think is the
next big milestone kind of looking forward so looking back to from where it took you to where you are now and what’s
what’s the next thing after that what do you think yeah so we started in 2019 so
it’s almost five years later which is just crazy crazy to think about obviously it’s one of those yeah fully
preco you know completely different world we were coming into this new
startup with a lot of R&D in front of us and I think that’s if I had to say you know what chapter did we just have for
the company and what’s in the future we have built up this technical Moe um and it’s connected to the reason why a lot
of companies don’t innovate in the space um that was one of the insights that we had when we were looking at the
competitive landscape and maybe why all the tampons had the same feature and no
innovation was there are a lot of new brands but when you kind of peel back the the
curtain there they’re only they’re private labeling so they’re not actually creating a new product they are just
licensing or using another product with their branding um and their marketing and so I think that also indicated to us
right there’s there’s an opportunity here there’s some there’s a couple reasons why people haven’t innovated in
the space and those are the three things that we’ve really focused on so one is the IP obvious viously we’re going up
against some pretty large companies with sharp elbows in the IP space that’s been a huge priority for us is just
establishing that portfolio so the count today is I think we have 12 that are cleared and eight that are pending and
that’s been a big big initiative internally uh the second is manufacturing so over the past couple
years big Focus has been how can we make this at scale obviously need to make the unit Economics work out and be able to
mass distribute this product then the third is the FDA clearance and so that was we achieved that last year that’s I
think a huge reason why a small company might see tampon specifically as
something not to mess with because you don’t really want to be a medical device spec developer or distributor um but
that those are the three huge Milestones that we’ve we’ve really been focusing on for the past five years in terms of what
is next yeah what where it is that chapter of bringing
this product to life so I I that’s what I like to think of that is we have our moat now how do we distribute this to
people how do we get into this commercialization phase which is a huge gear shift for the company as R&D R&D
R&D just get to the legal ability to sell this product and then now it is
okay how do we get this to people establish our key metrics um and and
really develop some Traction in the market I mean it’s been five years and
you’ve I mean you’ve hit a lot of really big Milestones manufacturing IP clearance from the FDA and now you’re
getting it out starting to get it out on the market in the early days of SQL did
you have a moment where you thought what if this is a fringe product and people
aren’t going to try it you know what have you done to overcome that worry because everybody’s got that fear of
that product I’m developing maybe I’m a bigger and more Ardent supporter of it
than the market will be um how’ you get over that that that
worry I think that’s a that’s a very accurate feeling of that that
kind of doubt um I think one thing that is connected to that is something that
one of our investors and advisers who actually taught this class called Launchpad in the design school in the D
school at Stanford encourage us to do is get out of your own like you could sit
at a desk and do this for 5 10 years but he really is H his emphasis is really on
the voice of the consumer and so if you can keep that close to you that not only
guides you back when when times are maybe when you’re doubting yourself but also if you are just looking at this as
a theory without the voice of the customer you can you can get really off track so I think in terms of the is it a
niche product I think the the data kind kind of speaks in terms of how big the market is how many tampon users there
are and then the knowledge of how many manufacturers there are we just knew there’s a white space there but in terms
of will people try this will they be interested in this that kind of validation comes from just continual
voice of the customer work um and I think that stuff happens now even with feedback from our website our packaging
our boxes but and and now we’re actually finally at the point where people can try the product and say okay here was my
experience this is what I felt this is what I expected um and I think that that is really motivating to to be there I
mean just kind of building on us a little bit um so this may be a little bit of a loaded question but what what’s
what’s been the single biggest stumbling block or obstacle that you faced in
turning this idea which you know was sparked in a class and also your experience on the field into a real
viable business I’m sure there there’s many hurdles to clear but what do you think’s been the biggest stumbling block
that if other people said to you what are the things that you really have to look out for from your experience what
would you point to I think the maybe this isn’t a
specific stumbling block but it really is the balance for us about being
diligent and confident in our regulatory strategy as well as being Nimble enough
to be a consumer facing product so while the FDA clearance is an amazing moat it
comes with a a lot of paperwork to say the least and that can make that can be
burdensome as as you know Dan I think it’s not you know we’re not feel like I’m swimming through design history
files and other materials yeah that will not end and that that that I think is
the the balance that is top of mine now as we change from Full AR D to
commercialization is okay how can we be a Nimble and responsive brand to
Consumers because they’re finding us not like other medical devices through doctors and through reimbursement but
you have to be you have to have a social media presence and I think that coupled
with we have a quality team we have a regulatory person you know those things don’t always Jive so I think that’s that
I say would be the the most challenging thing I got to so I I just to turn the
page a little bit of a of an aside um you know one of the most kind of topical
things lately has been the rise of Caitlyn Clark and um for those who’ve
been living under a rock you know they’ll they wouldn’t know that Caitlyn Clark is like the biggest sensation she
was just on Saturday Night Live they say that she’s like double ticket sales for
for college basketball sponsorships I mean she’s like sort of Taken women’s
basketball and Basketball by the Scruff of the neck and dragged it into the next Century um is there a Caitlyn Clark
effect do you think for for other areas like you know women’s entrepreneurship
and not just sports but but beyond and further what what do you think and was a little bit of a of a non sequer but I
felt like I had to throw it out to you since there’s very much in your the crosshairs of the work that you do yeah
we have and obviously cheering her on and and watching the tournament this year was such just so much fun
especially contrasted with years past where there was much less viewership or maybe just fewer of your friends
watching it and talking about it so it’s been an absolute just treat for everyone
I think the the question about how it relates to other Industries I’m not sure there’s a
direct effect there but I think for us we’re really positioned as a
product for athletic women and so we are very much grateful for this kind of wave
of attention that is coming especially as we’re talking to professional soccer
basketball and many other sports teams in the US I think the the thing with
Caitlyn Clark is that she has brought attention to not only her games but the
entire the entire tournament so people were watching all all sides of the bracket and really it has it has
benefited many other players as well as well as brought attention to how much
media it takes you know it takes some investment to even get those those games
streamed but then when you do that what happens after and I’m I’m hoping that that kind of case study can be an
example of okay maybe some of these companies or for example I think you’re
bringing up a great point about female Founders if you have few game streamed obviously your viewership
is going to be lower so that kind of Chicken and the Egg where we’re seeing all right if let’s just take some star
power as a catalyst to really make this a a big splash My Hope Is that we see
many more case studies like that in the future and I’m I’m wondering I mean this is a bit of opining could there is there
a Caitlyn Clark effect um for things like you know fem Tech where you know in
the startup space you know in that an area which was under represented by women um all of a sudden
there’s somebody that that’s been a Trailblazer who’s the who’s the Caitlyn Clark for startup entrepreneurs it could
be you Greta but um you know what what your thoughts like is is that something that’s still kind of there’s a yawning
need um you know as we see there’s underinvestment in in female entrepreneurs and in common areas like
that your your thoughts yeah I think it’s the same it is really the same principle of to the
people that doubt it and might not want to invest in it it it takes one and then
several more to follow to show this would be you know this type of founder
is a great type of person to invest in I think one that comes to mind is Thea Blakeley um at Spanx and I think her
story can show all right you know her early if she had some early investors
they would be doing really well right now but the fact that she struggled through those early phases um really
shows her grit and tenacity as a founder and then can also Open the Eyes of
potential investors to say not only is it I think there’s a little bit of a oh
this would be um you know in fem tech people say okay I don’t invest in that Niche
but it’s not we have to get out of thinking of it in that way and think of it as it’s an investment opportunity
like any other so that is really our our duty as Founders in this space is to not
not focus on the you should invest in more female Founders but in focus on the this is an opportunity like any other
and I’m gonna I’m going to do the work to show you that that’s that’s great I like that and I that that’s uh I I think
this is a rising tide that’ll end up lifting all boats so um you know I want
to come back to product design for just a moment um you know I one of the things I like to hear about are the deliberate
or systematic practices that people follow and I’d love to hear more from you are there particular more deliberate
practices that you recommend to people who are trying to create a new product idea but they’re just not sure how do I
go about doing it what are some of those deliberate or intentional practices that that you’ve used um that you would
recommend for other people to do the the top one is is really it
connects to the voice of the consumer point that I had mentioned before um and it’s something that we focused a lot on
in the dchool which is make a low Fidelity prototype because you will get
feedback from a consumer with something that is perhaps drawn on a piece of paper that will then educate you about
what to what where to spend your resources to make a higher Fidelity prototype and I think what we see a lot
even in even in software even in apps is okay I’m going to go build V1 of the app and
then show it to people even if they’re beta testers what we learned and what was hammered into my brain is that even
that is too high fidelity you need to be showing them you know a drawing of a
phone with three things on it or talking them through a scenario about what that
app might be able to do because I do think we get so focused on the type of solution that we’re not really listening
to the consumer about what that should look like um so I would say low Fidelity
and that can be extremely challenging when you’re dealing with a medical device as you know you can’t just say
try this you know prototype of a tampon um that that would need to be a clinical
study I think there’s how did you bridge that or when when you were getting early feedback on it but you didn’t have it
quite built yet um what was your low Fidelity approach
yeah so we were we were focused on proving it out from a technical perspective and so what that looked like
was taking apart existing tampons to to find those fibers and then we were
reforming them we worked with a seamstress to create some initial
prototypes we did different felting techniques I mean we were just trying to get some representation of what this
would look like and we even did that very very early on with rope where we
were able to just show okay this pattern of channels changes how this type of
fluid flows granted we’re not suggesting that the tampon should be made of rope but it was like a an experiment we
worked on with a fluid mechanics Professor that proved that theory terms of customer feedback I think we were
able to try the product and were confident about the safety of it um but obviously that that kind of stuff is not
necessarily above the board of how you could test most medical devices it was just we felt confident about the safety
and were able to take a a personal risk there I love I love that story and I love that example of the ropes aren’t
the the model or the the modality that you’re after it’s trying to prove out a principle and uh that’s a great example
of really thoughtful experimentation so thank you for for sharing that one um I
I want to go just a couple of clicks deeper if you don’t mind about femtech and you’re in the femtech
industry that’s uh you know which is supposedly one of the fastest growing Industries I don’t know if you feel it
um it’s like 60% year-over-year for the past five years uh from what I’ve seen
reported and the Biden Administration just had announced not very long ago the
women’s health research initiative the government’s committing something on the order of a hundred million for women’s
health research so with that in mind do you think from kind of where you stand
that fem Tech and women’s health is kind of the next big boom Market um what
what’s your your sense of that yeah I think what we need to
continue this momentum is a couple exits from from Founders in the space I think
that is what is going to continue people’s appetite to invest in in the space I think it’s amazing to have some
government funding behind it and that is is only going to encourage more people
to try things in the space not all of them will succeed obviously but um the
more shots we have on goal the more success stories we’ll have and then I think we can all benefit from that yeah
anything you’re really excited about like other Tech besides SQL um what are
some fem Tech things that you’ve seen or heard about you’re like these are exciting like you should keep your eyes
out for these what what do you think what’s what stands out for you yeah I think I mean I love the company
midi Health they’re really focused on menopause um and and that whole space I think that’s wonderful and then I think
also Freda which does kind of like mom and baby care they just have really wonderful product design as well as
marketing those are two that come to mind in term that are very I think well
formed thesis around uh what the needs are and our our great businesses
that’s awesome that very exciting we’re seeing more stuff around BV also or bacterial vaginosis not a topic that’s a
dinnertime concept but there’s been funding for a couple of big products in that space seeing some bigger companies
all starting to get involved so it seems like it’s hitting around all kind of corners and sizes of businesses not just
in startup but large companies moving in there as well absolutely those are the
ones that can also afford to wait for the research and really invest in some
of those findings I do think sometimes we have startups that see a see a space
or an opportunity that might not be able to you know fund a clinical study around something for 5 to 10 years or look at a
lot of historical research so I think the Partnerships sometimes between those larger organizations and startups are
hugely beneficial to to the End customer any particular development
areas that you think are under represented right now in fem Tech that that needs more product development um
what do you think and it could be from the well it could be could be anything um anything stand out from from what
you’ve been seeing it’s a great question I think the
one that we are seeing I think a lot of
a lot of childbirth products I think that’s one that that there is a huge
opportunity however those are also they have that kind of FDA side to them
whereas other Industries might be able to iterate more quickly as we’ve as
we’ve mentioned that’s a tradeoff um and then I think yeah it’s great that you mentioned BV I think there’s a a huge
opportunity in Diagnostics I think we’re going to see that change that space change a little bit in terms of how the
science is educating us I think there’s some some products that are more scientifically backed than other others
right now on the space uh on the market and I think as we see a couple years in
the market we’ll be able to see some more of what’s the actual consumer benefit versus there is a little bit of
that kind of fear mongering right now around do I have BV do I not how often do I need to test um do I need
supplements for it and so my hope is that those those more consumer facing and less scientifically backed companies
start to come closer to that that uh research clinical
back I mean and I have to ask you you know it’s men generally don’t want to
discuss menstrual cycles it’s just for whatever reason it’s it’s not really like the barroom conversations that that
guys seem to have but even beyond that um I I was looking before
2016 most of the research on menstrual cycles was just limited to a few thousand people was very small sets of
data and now there’s literally tens of millions of of Records a of structured
data that’s that’s available around about menstruation menstrual cycles so there’s been an explosion in data in
availability what’s your thought about that why people become more comfortable talking about it researching it um what
what’s changed in the past five to 10 years yeah I think a lot of the fact
that there are startups bringing attention to this uh I think the research is amazing and and I’m blanking
on on the year but I think it’s 19 883 or 73 that the that actually a clinical
study was required to have women participants so I think we’ve seen that
that data point actually impact people’s interest in studying this and
saying huh maybe this drug should be tested on women as well not just men and
then we take off you know 20% for for body weight in terms of prescribed use
so I think it is important I think the the menstrual specific stuff is also new
just because people are seeing this as I mean a lot of a lot of companies are saying it’s a Vital sign right your
menstration is not something to just ignore and try to make you know try to
make the symptoms go away but it could be something that’s actually a a health indicator um and there’s a lot of data
on the the the patient in menstrual affluent and and different different
information we could glean there that’s somewhere that we I think the the data is still or the research is still rather
young but I think I’m I’m hopeful that as as more studies come out we’ll we’ll be able to actually make some
conclusions from it are are have you been finding are most women comfortable talking about menstruation when you do
research or Reach Out is there like a momentary like uh all right I guess I could talk about this or are people very
open what what’s been your your observation about Comfort level for the average average woman to talk about
it yeah I think because of our position because they know that we are super
comfortable talking about it because we talk about it all day and and sometimes we actually we talk about it as an
engineering problem right we’re talking about the fluid mechanics you could have a whole conversation about I mean we
have many manufacturing conversations that are not really about your period they’re more about how is the product
performing how is it’s a it’s more of a sterile conversation for lack of a better word um but I think in general
we’re seeing that taboo perspective of menstruation it
still persists today which I think sometimes is surprising um just in terms of who we are as I was saying people are
comfortable but sometimes they will say oh this is probably TMI but you know my
flow is this and this this and this and from our perspective that’s not TMI at
all that’s user research that’s really valuable information so please share that but I think that’s an indicator
that maybe we’re in this bubble where people are really comfortable sharing to us but probably not to the rest of their
Community um I think a lot of times we see these these conversations happen in very safe kind of girl only spaces where
they know that people are also having these experiences versus talking to people that might be uncomfortable by it
but My Hope Is that we we can keep normalizing it keep making it a natural
bodily function and having it be something that’s not necessarily crazy to talk about yeah awesome um what one
more question and then I have a a game for you that that I like to play whenever we do kind of interviews with
uh with friends so last question for you though is um when you think about kind
of who and what inspires you um who have you looked to or or what have
you looked for for inspiration to keep kind of traveling this difficult journey of of being an entrepreneur um who who’s
giving you that inspiration who do you draw it from yes I would say
the recently it’s been a lot of other Founders and some of them could be
thought of as competitors some of them are in different spaces that are tangentially related maybe um for women
and men but it’s like a deodorant company or some something else that’s maybe personal care but not directly um
competitive and I think those those Founders are wonderful because you’re able to share kind of these War Stories
so to speak but also draw from those those experiences that they had and I
think one learning there is in finding mentors yes you can find someone that EX exited you know an amazing company that
they started 20 years ago and had a had a great story they might not actually
remember what you’re really going through right then so I think the most helpful people are those that are you
know one to two to three years ahead of you where they’re still not really on
the other side so to speak but they are they are further along and they can help
guide you through that I think those are those are the people I draw inspiration from and I also try to kind of pay it
forward and back in terms of talking to students and that’s where we were several years ago and saying here’s what
here’s how I would think about it here’s what I wish I knew at your stage and that’s really a a wonderful resource is
just finding mentors I also think you can find a lot of that on podcasts a lot
of that is not just through networking but people are pretty transparent on on
talks like these Dan yeah well you’ve given a lot of wisdom already I’m I’m going to recommend it to anybody who’s a
startup entrepreneur looking to start or continue um well awesome I’ve got one
more thing for us to do together it’s a a little game I call myth or reality so
what I’m going to do is I’m going to invite you to be a contestant um and tell me whether you think something is a
myth or a reality or maybe it’s somewhere in between maybe it’s a meity
um and uh I’m going to present that to you and I’m ask you just to elaborate a little bit on your answer how that that
sound to you I’m game all right ready here’s the first one your big Ideas come
to you in a momentary flash of insight is that a myth or a
reality I would say that is a myth tell do
tell I think you can have an Insight but I think the true work comes through
thinking through it and thinking through the details um and that an Insight doesn’t come
without months or you know hundreds of interviews or a lot of work upfront so
it’s not like you would just be walking down the street and and something would come to you you would have that would be
if if that does happen that’s a product of a lot of work beforehand I’m buying what you’re you’re
selling on that one I’m agreeing that that’s more of a myth um all right
myth or reality if you want to succeed you need to be first to
Market I would also say myth I think there are some Industries
where there is a first mover Advantage but if you
are a second to Market third to Market and you have I think that can often be
an advantage because you can learn from the first one and say I think they went wrong here here and here I’m gonna
actually do this differently I’m buying on that one too I
I like that I agree and if that was true that wouldn’t bode well for your business or mine for that matter so I’m
I’m absolutely in agreement on that um all right next one myth or reality
customers generally know what they
want I would say reality but they might not know how to
articulate it um so my final answer is
reality but they might not tell you what that looks like but if they see
something and experience it they will say that and I think the the quote is the Henry Ford one which is possibly
over quoted about the horse versus the car if I asked somebody if they wanted a
car they would say no I want a faster horse so yeah I think that’s a that’s a famous quote for a reason it’s a it’s a
true one but if you had somebody use a car then they’re going to say this is
awesome of course and so you you do all like if if I’m Henry Ford in that moment
doing all these interviews finding people that’s saying I want a faster horse he’s going to then look at that
and say okay how can I make that happen I probably can’t come up with like this
God created animal in a different form how can I what are they really saying I want to get from A to B faster and that
might be his his inspiration yeah the job to be done yeah that that’s a that’s a great Point good
good uh good use of the Henry Ford quote it is definitely off quoted to say the least um all right going a little
further down the lane for startups fast growth comes first profitability later
is that a myth or a reality I would say maybe in 2021 that would be
reality right now absolutely a myth I think the market right now is it’s not
necessarily even about speed of growth but the I would say profitability as a
product of like organic growth a lot of times is you really have to have the
fundamentals and there’s not money flying around like there was to say
figure it out later in terms of profitability so I think that that can e and flow with the market I think right
now definitely profitability or some path to it first all right I’m I’m
buying on that one too um myth or reality startup entrepreneurs are fine
to go at Alan versus having a partner what do you
say I think that is true I think there are there are pros and cons to to both
approaches it really depends on the person I know a lot of wonderful solo
Founders and and co-founders and yeah there are just there are pros and cons
to to each approach all right last couple you need to raise investment Capital first before
you start is that a myth or reality definitely myth um I
think it it obviously depends on on what the company is I think for us we had a
huge R&D cost before we were able to get FDA clearance so for a lot of these Med
devices that actually probably is true but for some consumer businesses or if
there’s less red tape to actually start bootstrapping and get get sales would a
absolutely um myth and and it actually would probably benefit the business to forgo that in the in the short term or
in the start yeah I always think of the Lennon McCartney example that greatness
comes from Duos but there’s a lot of individual entrepreneurs out there also much harder to do by yourself but having
a partner a co-founder with you and you know the the value and the benefit of of
having co-founders and also raising Capital together it’s very very tricky
um all right I’m gonna I’m gonna just ask you one more thing which uh may hit
on very much on a personal note um do do startup Founders have a life
outside of work this is a good one um I would say
yes yes I would say yes however it is harder it’s harder to turn it off it’s
not oh you know my boss is sending me an email how annoying it’s I maybe I can’t
stop thinking about this or there is no nothing I’d rather be doing so I think
you you defin itely can have a life outside of work I think honestly for us
something that we tried to really avoid was like founder burnout and I think that was yeah something that just for me
starting out was kind of okay there’s so many so many risks in the business don’t
let your own you know battery be one of them and and I think we’ve had a lot of
stamina in the in the business but that comes with maintaining balance in your own health and um not burning yourself
out because for me that would be not the way not the way to end the journey I I I
have to ask it wasn’t one that I was contemplating but since you bring this up how do you keep your stamina up as a
as an entrepreneur it it can be very tiresome and there’s so many walls that
you hit you have to break through a lot of walls what have you done to maintain your stamina and not you know let the
battery get run down to zero yeah I think it’s a a lot of the
energy comes from the other people in in my life I think some of those mentors
can also serve as energy sources when you are when you’re having a tough day or when you’re in a in a pinch for
something um and then also just you know I think that’s one of the I live in San Francisco one of the great kind of
recharging things that I do is just getting outside go for a walk go for a run um and not to say that your mind
isn’t on maybe the thing at hand but it can help you just maintain that kind of
human aspect to it and um and sometimes you just need to sleep on whatever it is
so a lot of that is taking breaks and and understanding what needs to be done right now versus uh a little bit later
yeah it can’t not everything could be in an emergency or on fire that that’s for sure um well first of all you’ve been
awesome but I’ve got one last thing that I’d love to hear from you advice
recommendations to somebody who is embarking on a similar Journey that you
did um they’re thinking about becoming an entrepreneur they’re at that that
threshold what advice would you give to the younger you or to that that person
maybe they’re not younger many we know a lot of entrepreneurs they often are starting in their 30s or 40s which is
not atypical but somebody who’s a neoy and they’re right at the threshold of doing this what would you tell them
yeah I would say realize that it’s a process it’s not going to be zero to 100 in a day or a month um but don’t over
Plan before doing so just start doing and I think that goes back to your
question on do you have to raise money before doing anything no you should do as much as you can without doing that um
and and talk to customers and validate those needs and all of that is a valuable Foundation moving forward um as
well as learn from people that have come before you um yeah find those mentors and keep them keep them close if you
have a good relationship awesome all right well we heard to hear first from you and I can’t
wait to see sequel on the store shelves sometime soon and hearing about maybe
Caitlyn Clark or other people using the product and highlighting it but you know
that that’s uh hopefully sometime soon but Greta what what a a real honor treat
to have you here great startup founder great insights we’ve been doing some amazing things and we look forward to
seeing more successes from you in the near future and to have you back on again for an interview to talk about all
the awesome things that have happened since our last interview so thanks again for being here thanks for having me Dan
appreciate it I’m great to see you all right well until our next episode of the deliberate way we’ll see you next time
